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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
58
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Posted - 2013.03.23 23:45:00 -
[1] - Quote
I just want to say to CCP, please do not simplify or dumb down the scanning system in anyway.
That is my only concern. Apart from that interested to see what they mean by allowing us to explore new frontiers which we have never seen before. Hopefully null sec exploration will become a bit more profitable. |
Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
59
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Posted - 2013.03.24 00:07:00 -
[2] - Quote
Quintessen wrote:Rebecha Pucontis wrote:I just want to say to CCP, please do not simplify or dumb down the scanning system in anyway.
That is my only concern. Apart from that interested to see what they mean by allowing us to explore new frontiers which we have never seen before. Hopefully null sec exploration will become a bit more profitable. As long as it's not press button, get cookie I have trouble thinking of how it could be easier. Anyways, I'll wait till I see the proposal before I get upset or anything.
The current probing mechanics are complex if that is what you are referring too. They take quite a lot of skill and knowledge to effectively master. Obviously finding anomolies is really simple though. I just hope they don't dumb down the probing mechanics.
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Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
59
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Posted - 2013.03.24 00:16:00 -
[3] - Quote
^^ What would a high sec miner know about the probing mechanics? :) |
Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
59
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Posted - 2013.03.24 00:22:00 -
[4] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Rebecha Pucontis wrote:^^ What would a high sec miner know about the probing mechanics? :) enough to probe down grav sites in 0.0 with nothing but astrometrics II and no other scanning skills. :)
So you can manage to probe a static grav, you deserve a cookie. :)
Also you astrometrics is only at level II? I need say no more. :) |
Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
63
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Posted - 2013.03.24 00:34:00 -
[5] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:why? i fail to see how training more skills to make it easier strengthens my point of; scanning is already easy.
Exactly, you fail to see. Your astro is only at II, and you have barely scratched the surface with scanning. Some of the advanced techniques can only be done with 8 probes, and 7 is minimum for anyone serious. |
Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
64
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Posted - 2013.03.24 00:54:00 -
[6] - Quote
Stray Bullets wrote:Roime wrote:Sounds interesting and I really like the theme.
However if I'd have to pick either drone UI or scanner UI from the two of my most used specific UIs, I'd choose drone UI for revamping. If they're revamping the Scanner UI as a first step to move away from local as a source of intel, then I'd prefer they go with that route first. Drone UI needs some serious love but if the scanner UI can replace local in any practical form, it's priority in my book.
The problem is there would have to be some way of picking up cloaked ship. Currently local is the only method to do this. If they can add this functionality to the dscanner though then I'll be saying bye bye to my local window. :) |
Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
68
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Posted - 2013.03.24 18:06:00 -
[7] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Adoris Nolen wrote:Dave Stark wrote:Quote:A re-imagined scanning system, intuitive navigation and new exploration modules will aid you as you search the heavens for your next conquest. you have my attention, ccp. And those of us who a pro, and i say pro at scanning all have upset stomachs now. i see you like to drag and drop little cubes. good show.
As has been explained to you many times in this thread, the probing mechanics are more complex than simply dragging cubes as you keep repeating. I'm not going to waste my time explaining the more advanced techniques to you though, if you really wanted to learn then you can simply use google.
I'm finding it very amusing listening to your foolishness, preaching at us from your armchair regarding the scanning mechanics, when you have previously admitted that you only have your Astro skill at level II and clearly know very little on the matter. |
Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
68
|
Posted - 2013.03.24 18:13:00 -
[8] - Quote
Bloody Wench wrote:Rebecha Pucontis wrote:Dave Stark wrote:why? i fail to see how training more skills to make it easier strengthens my point of; scanning is already easy. Exactly, you fail to see. Your astro is only at II, and you have barely scratched the surface with scanning. Some of the advanced techniques can only be done with 8 probes, and 7 is minimum for anyone serious. 4 is the minimum sweetheart, 6 is overkill and any more than that and you clearly have NFI what you're doing.
I've got an idea, how about you actually listen to someone who knows what their talking about. 3 is actually the minimum you need to pick up a scanning signature so your wrong in that respect too.
Try telling anyone who lives in a wormhole they don't need the 7 probes and should start using 4, they'll tell you where you can stick your advice. :)
Again, amazed at the fools preaching on the scanning system who clearly know nothing about it. |
Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
68
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Posted - 2013.03.24 18:19:00 -
[9] - Quote
Dave Stark wrote:Rebecha Pucontis wrote:As has been explained to you many times in this thread, the probing mechanics are more complex than simply dragging cubes as you keep repeating. except, that simply isn't true.
And you can say that from your limited knowledge of scanning the easiest static grav sites with Astrometrics at level II? :)
Lol, its amusing watching fools dig them selves deeper into hole. |
Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
68
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Posted - 2013.03.24 18:22:00 -
[10] - Quote
Pelea Ming wrote:Dave Stark wrote:Rebecha Pucontis wrote:As has been explained to you many times in this thread, the probing mechanics are more complex than simply dragging cubes as you keep repeating. except, that simply isn't true. Seriously, how about you two stop taking up needless space on this thread with what is a pointless argument and just go shoot each other in the game?
It's actually relevant to the thread as the scanning mechanics are currently good in my opinion. Although Dave in all his wisdom and with his Astrometrics skill at level II is telling everyone who trained up to IV and V that they have wasted their time and that there is really nothing to it. |
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Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
72
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Posted - 2013.03.24 18:33:00 -
[11] - Quote
Who made you the forum police? You just ruined the fun I was having. |
Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
73
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Posted - 2013.03.24 19:43:00 -
[12] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:The whole issue of scanning covers a lot of ground, and frankly changes ARE needed. I don't know too many people that don't think that scanning currently is an extremely tedious task, with little (if any) fun or excitement involved.
I agree with quite a lot in your post there. But just to pick up on this point, scanning at the basic level is quite boring so I agree with that. But once your skill and knowledge has increased so that you can scan down sites in very little time, picking up a sig becomes akin to getting a head shot in other games in that you get some satisfaction for each one you get. And each one can yield a profitable site which adds the the addictiveness of scanning them down. Personally I find scanning quite relaxing and enjoyable, although maybe I am in the minority here.
Also there are methods which allow you to scan down an entire system of 40 or 50 signatures in under 10 minutes. Mastering these techniques brings even more enjoyment to the system. Also if you have the knowledge you can at a glance recognise what a particular site is likely to be by picking up on the initial signal strength adding a whole new aspect to the system which have been wonderfully covered by some of the great eve explorers.
So saying scanning is boring in a blanket statement, is similar to saying mission running is boring based on running only a level 1 mission.
As for the whole combat probing mechanics, it all adds another dimension in my opinion, and combat probes should be an effective counter to sniper fleets, although maybe at the moment they could tone down the effectiveness.
I just hope CCP are not going to destroy the system they currently have, it is one of the things which actually works really well at the moment.
Adding new and more interesting sites to explore on the other hand, that is certainly something I am in favour of. |
Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
73
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Posted - 2013.03.24 19:56:00 -
[13] - Quote
On a more important note, did anyone else have a wtf moment when a medieval armoured knight walked past as CCP were giving the Oddysy presentation. :) |
Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
73
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Posted - 2013.03.24 20:04:00 -
[14] - Quote
Made me chuckle. :) |
Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
73
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Posted - 2013.03.25 05:40:00 -
[15] - Quote
Mr Kidd wrote:Rebecha Pucontis wrote:[quote=Ranger 1]
So saying scanning is boring in a blanket statement, is similar to saying mission running is boring based on running only a level 1 mission. No, it's pretty spot on. Come on, high skills, expensive equipment and implants aside, once you do it a couple of dozen times the mystic is gone. After the umpteenth thousandth time you're ready to give your right testicle if only you didn't have to press f1 x number of times to launch your probes and then have to configure their arrangement by hand. Sure, there are techniques you develop over time of say a couple of months with higher level skills. Beyond that, there's nothing except tedium.
I'm not arguing against some automation in the system, I can just imagine CCP's idea of simplification would be something akin to only needing one probe and simply hitting scan to get a cookie.
Not having to press F1 to launch each individual probe would be great. Also a preset selection of probe formations would be even better. What would be even greater would be if you could customise your own formation and then save and recall them at will. So I'm certainly not disagreeing on those fronts. |
Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
74
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Posted - 2013.03.25 15:10:00 -
[16] - Quote
Xenuria wrote:Rengerel en Distel wrote:Blake Gates Heleneto wrote:They may have outdone themselves. I was just thinking how underwhelming it is. My thoughts exactly. No hats? No graphical improvements? What happened to tessellation? WHERE is the pretty pink dress?
Did you actually watch the video? They quite clearly said there would be graphical improvements. |
Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
75
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Posted - 2013.03.26 18:38:00 -
[17] - Quote
Pelea Ming wrote:Rebecha Pucontis wrote:Xenuria wrote:Rengerel en Distel wrote:Blake Gates Heleneto wrote:They may have outdone themselves. I was just thinking how underwhelming it is. My thoughts exactly. No hats? No graphical improvements? What happened to tessellation? WHERE is the pretty pink dress? Did you actually watch the video? They quite clearly said there would be graphical improvements. graphical improvements don't mean that much to those of us who have to run them at minimums anyways due to system resource limitations (though that will be changing in a few more months when I finally upgrade my piece of ****, woot!)
I have my graphics on the minimum also. Was just replying to the poster above who was complaining about the graphics. |
Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
75
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Posted - 2013.03.26 23:20:00 -
[18] - Quote
Quintessen wrote:Josef Djugashvilis wrote:The problem is, that removing one man's tedious is another man's dumbing down. I can quote an exact process here. 1) find configuration online 2) launch to new location 3) move to safe spot 4) launch probes (enough for configuration) 5) move all to center (using shift drag) 6) arrange into configuration 7) center probes around blip (using shift drag) 8) size down probes (shift drag and alt drag) so they look smaller 9) scan 10) if less than 100% goto 7 11) get bacon Not a lot of thinking in the above. It's not like the locations fight back or change the parameters as you scan. That's tedium. It's playing the same chess game over and over again when you know how your opponent will move. Maybe it has more than one move set, but once you've seen all the possible moves, it's the same each and every time. That's the very definition of tedium.
Scanning novices. When you reach master status like those of us who scan 100s of signatures a day then you will learn that your fumbling attempts to scan signatures can be much improved using knowledge and skills only possessed by true scanning masters. I would tell you these techniques but then I'd have to kill you. |
Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
75
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Posted - 2013.03.26 23:23:00 -
[19] - Quote
Pelea Ming wrote:Rebecha Pucontis wrote:
I have my graphics on the minimum also. Was just replying to the poster above who was complaining about the graphics.
*gives hugs* it's ok, given time we will all someday be able to set some decent graphics for this :)
For now we will just have to watch the trailers and hope. :)
James Amril-Kesh wrote:Would graphics improvements mean getting rid of the damn clouds in missions, anomalies, and exploration sites?
Nope, unfortunately those annoying clouds are still present even on the minimum settings.
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Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
75
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Posted - 2013.03.26 23:29:00 -
[20] - Quote
Roime wrote:Quintessen wrote:Josef Djugashvilis wrote:The problem is, that removing one man's tedious is another man's dumbing down. I can quote an exact process here. 1) find configuration online 2) launch to new location 3) move to safe spot 4) launch probes (enough for configuration) 5) move all to center (using shift drag) 6) arrange into configuration 7) center probes around blip (using shift drag) 8) size down probes (shift drag and alt drag) so they look smaller 9) scan 10) if less than 100% goto 7 11) get bacon Not a lot of thinking in the above. It's not like the locations fight back or change the parameters as you scan. That's tedium. It's playing the same chess game over and over again when you know how your opponent will move. Maybe it has more than one move set, but once you've seen all the possible moves, it's the same each and every time. That's the very definition of tedium. lol Exact process: 1) launch probe, move to place x 8 2) scan 3) move 4) resize 5) scan 6) bookmark / warp to location You scan faster with experience and dealing with doubles, rings and spheres requires at least some thinking. Good scanner finds a route in matter of minutes, bad scanner wastes 45 min to the same job. It's not just dependant on character skills. I've seen level IV scanners struggle. D-scanner separates the good from the bad even more efficiently. Both tools could use serious usability improvements, but simplifying the mechanics themselves is really difficult while still maintaining the importance of player skill.
Exactly ^ There is a reason why your probes show spheres and rings in their results. Also there is a reason why signatures have different strengths, and learning to recognise the typical characteristics of scanning signatures will turn a novice into a master.
Also advanced techniques require 8 probe setups which I am sure most the people complaining about scanning don't know about. |
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Rebecha Pucontis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
75
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Posted - 2013.03.26 23:33:00 -
[21] - Quote
Pelea Ming wrote: *grins* I don't know how many I've run across personally who claim to know it all about probing and insist to me that all you ever need is just 4 probes
^ Exacly :) And it seems a lot of them are on these forums. |
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